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Episode 6: Building respectful and affirming school cultures

14 May 2025

In this episode we hear from student Willow and Wellbeing Leader Taylor about the restorative work Charles Campbell College is doing to support and champion LGBTQIA+ students. Learn how the school fosters a safe and inclusive learning environment where all students feel valued and supported. We’ll also discuss the Department for Education resources that schools can use to better support LGBTIQA+ communities, so everyone feels like they belong.

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Show Notes

Show notes:

We’d love to hear your thoughts on this episode and any ideas you have for future topics. Get in touch with the Teach Podcast team at education.teachpodcast@sa.gov.au.

Transcript

Dale Atkinson: Hello and welcome to Teach, a podcast about teaching and learning in South Australia. My name is Dale Atkinson from South Australia's Department for Education. And today we're talking about gender and sexual diversity in SA schools. There are many students in our schools who identify as LGBTQIA+. They have unique perspectives and experiences that educators need to be aware of and to consider in their day-to-day practice. Today we're going to explore the in-school experiences of students who identify as gender diverse.

We're going to discuss a little bit about how schools in SA are and can provide safe and inclusive environments for those students and provide a bit of an overview of the frameworks that can help schools better serve those communities. Before we start, I just want to acknowledge that the LGBTQIA+ acronym is evolving and used differently across groups in the community and it doesn't recognise Aboriginal cultural diversity. So we want to assure all our listeners that we value and recognise all identities, and that we know the acronym doesn't include everyone.

Topics in the episode may be of a sensitive nature today for some listeners and may bring up issues or experiences that have been or are currently distressing. If you need support, please seek assistance from one of the services listed in our show notes.

Today, we're lucky to be joined by Willow, who's a Year 11 student at Charles Campbell College, Taylor Goodwin, who's the wellbeing leader at Charles Campbell College, and by Yvonne Kranixfeld, who's the Senior Policy Officer for Diversity and Inclusion within the Department for Education in the wellbeing team. Welcome to all of you.

Willow: Thank you for having us.

Taylor Goodwin: Pleasure to be here.

Yvonne Kranixfeld: Yes, thankyou.

Dale Atkinson: First of all, Willow, maybe to you, can you describe yourself until the listeners a little bit about who you are?

Willow: Yeah, I'm Willow. I am 17 years old, transfeminine, so you know, male to female. And I've been almost three months on HRT, which is hormone replacement therapy. I like playing Warhammer, especially a lot of just like painting the figures I find is very fun. In general, I just really like doing art, just whatever comes to mind, scribble it. I like playing video games like most Gen Z folks currently doing a second play through a Baldur's Gate 3 and just the other typical – engage in media – like watch movies, read books. I've been reading House of Leaves recently.

Dale Atkinson:

Can you talk a little bit about how you describe your schooling experience as someone who is gender diverse?

Willow:

Well, among teachers I am treated very much the same as the other students, which is good most of the time when it comes to stuff like pronouns. If they're not sure, they will just refer to me as they, which I do not mind. Among students, things can be pretty different. Most students are alright, but of course there are a fair few out there who take issue with trans people, but I suppose that is something that will be discussed today.

Dale Atkinson:

Yeah, I think it will be Willow. So thank you very much for coming on. We really appreciate your time. You just spoke a bit about how, you know, the experience with the teachers has been quite good, but a little bit different or variable with your student colleagues You talk about what that's done to your sense of belonging and connection with the school community?

Willow:

Yeah, I mean like I mostly feel belonging among my friendship circle because they're the ones I talk to of course and are very understanding and accepting of me, and I just, it's almost kind of, I wouldn't say it's more alienating when there are students I know or, like, people who have made comments, and to me can feel alienating because, you know, I'm different.

Dale Atkinson:

Now you've taken quite a proactive approach, I think, within the school community to finding a home and also kind of reaching out and making connections. Can you tell us a little bit about what that experience has been like and the actions that you're involved with and you've taken in that space?

Willow:

Yeah me and, like, when it comes to stuff like making friends I struggled quite a bit for a while but I just found myself with those circles and when it comes to other things like the school's pride club I do occasionally attend and have met some people in there. Being one of the older students I have a bit of a role model kind of role to them.

Dale Atkinson:

And I might throw it to Taylor now, the wellbeing leader, Charles Campbell College. Can you talk about how the staff at your school, like, confidence is always an issue within these areas, there can sometimes be some anxiety about, you know, not doing the right thing or being perceived to behave in a way that isn't inclusive. Can you talk about how you've helped teachers to gain confidence and understanding in their own capacity in this area?

Taylor Goodwin:

Absolutely. I think staff sometimes feel like language is evolving quite quickly, but there are some quite deep roots in where this language is evolving from. So it's not something that has just appeared, it actually has a lot of historic basis. We've done training and development to upskill teachers, and we had a really good speaker, Aud Mason Hyde, actually have a in a really non-confronting way, just to upskill teachers about how to approach issues and how they can develop comfort in making mistakes, specifically around language and terminology and how to quickly move past where a mistake is made. And that is maybe misidentifying gender as an example of that. Students can feel anxious, Willow mentioned, having that they/them pronouns used, maybe because of an uncertainty.

So still a teacher trying to relate, but still not knowing the full complexity of that narrative. So we've done training and development. We've also had leaders attend training and development and bring that learning back within the school. And I feel like we do have a pretty consistent staff that have a stronger knowledge about how to handle the issues when they arise. I think it might be good just to make note that even one affirming person can have a significant change. And so sometimes that change takes time, but whenever a student does come to actually express themselves to you, it's a really vital moment and making sure you're following those gender affirmation plans to really support a young person in that vulnerable stance, because I think that's a huge part of change as well.

So even if you are at a site where that progress is slow, still making sure that you are someone who weighs the flag because we see statistically how much an impact that even one trusted adult can make on a young person going through gender identity or a part of the LGBTQIA+ community.

Dale Atkinson:

Taylor, that's such a strong message. Thank you very much. Now, this is a difficult question considering that you're sitting next to one of your educators there, Willow. But what do you perceive is working well within the school space for you and what might be different or made different and better for you?

Willow:

Yeah, well, I see that a lot of effort has been made among teachers to just, Like, educate and inform them about, like, the queer students and not necessarily peer-to-peer but just active engagement with the other teachers. And there are and set up like Wear It Purple Day, for example, or IDAHOBIT, which is a good effort. There is like a real difference between the teachers and the students because of course, as I mentioned previously students and kids can be mean, you know, that's just how it is sometimes. For the longest time bullying has been a problem in schools anyway that hasn't properly been solved.

Dale Atkinson:

Willow, is there something that a teacher has done that's made a big difference for you through your student career?

Willow:

Well, mostly I found it in the little things, like the other day an English teacher referring to me as ‘she’. That’s really just like, wow, it's cool to be recognised like that and not so much in just, like, what identity I have done – integrated that in some of my work before like in year 10 health and this year psychology, writing about gender dysphoria and how that can impact wellbeing. I have got support from teachers of course, but yeah it's mostly just ‘hey you're safe around me’ – that's cool.

Dale Atkinson:

Is there a message that you'd give to teachers and principals at other schools about being gender diverse within a school and how that can be accommodated and recognised and incorporated into the school life.

Willow:

Yeah, well, my journey at the school, I have done things like getting my gender changed on the role and for others to trans students, there'd be things like name change and that sort of stuff. Like, I think Charles Campbell is pretty progressive because as I mentioned before, events like Wear It Purple Day are really affirming of being recognised and supported. You could definitely take the more active kind of role in a way of just having talked with students and making sure that they're okay, but it's kind of weird of me to say that, like, someone will show up for help and I'm like ‘no I'm fine’, and then, yeah, like you find that with a lot of students, they’re just not really wanting it, it's not that they don't want help, it's just that they don't really want confrontation.

Dale Atkinson:

Yeah, that's always a challenge. I might throw it to Taylor now, listening to that, what does that make you think about in terms of if the journey of your school is undertaken and where you are now, but where you want to go?

Taylor Goodwin:

Yeah, look, I've seen, I guess, significant shift in our school and how we've handled issues surrounding this topic. I guess our overarching principles are belonging and student agency. So I guess for our part we have a priority focus on our pride group because we know the data sees that as a risk category group who can be more prone to experiencing bullying and that having a strong effect on them.

But bigger picture than that as well is building belonging for all. And we speak to the Pride Club and actually congratulate the Pride Club students about how their output such as IDAHOBIT and Wear It Purple actually provided templates for other students to develop their own sense of identity and belonging. One can be seen as more nonconformist, but their efforts really empower other students within our site to move forward in their own journey too, and actually find their own voices, which is pretty powerful.

Dale Atkinson:

Both you and Willow have kind of identified and talked a little bit about how this is a cohort of kids and students who typically have experienced bullying at a higher rate, have psychological issues sometimes as a result of some of those activities. Can you talk about how your school has addressed homophobic and transphobic student behaviour?

Taylor Goodwin:

We had essentially 2 years ago a Pride Club event which had almost an oppositional reaction from some students within the school. And I guess the part that is driving that force is equally and ironically those individual students own sense of self and their own sense of belonging. And when we look at bullying there are certainly individual factors that can impact on a young person's position to bully, but there are also a lot of evidences that show it is mainly developed through poor social connection.

So it's actually bringing those students aside and having restorative conversations. When we initiate Pride Club events, they're student driven. So we can clearly identify that this is student agency that has pushed us to the point. If a student brings forward an idea that is opposite of what we're trying to achieve. It's simply to bring that student aside and reassure them that our school is a safe site and an inclusive site, and the belonging of pride students is belonging for all.

So I think those restorative conversations, of course, we follow behaviour policies and sometimes you do need to activate a more serious sequence in a punitive type form, but normally I found by actually connecting students, having conversations, giving them education around what we're trying to do as a site, normally is the biggest impact for us and we've seen huge growth from that initial origin of having those oppositional reactions. We've held 4 events since we've re-energised our Pride Club and had those conversations – we haven't had one behaviour response at any of those events since we started to take the more restorative approach.

Dale Atkinson:

Yeah that's an incredible outcome. Now any wellbeing program, the individual components never act in isolation from each other and part of it is about creating a culture across a site that you know is the culture that you want to build as a school. How have you brought the entire cohort of students, teachers, families along on this journey, what's been the process of engagement in that space?

Taylor Goodwin:

The starting point for us is certainly student agency. So I guess when I walked into the Pride Club and I took my role, it was simply there to be a facilitator and my first step was to listen. We elected a student president who then at the forefront advised us really on what they needed to see at the school, the community level, what they wanted to achieve.

And that's really important because when driving that Pride Club, those students don’t have to be the advocates, and there’s lots of students who can take up that pathway, and we can simply setup a safe space for students. It doesn’t have to be an action group. We were fortunate in that our Pride Club was heavily focused on the actions, and wanted to achieve different outcomes in our school. And so by letting them drive – I was a strong facilitator but I actually got to step back a lot and let them lead the way and that's been fantastic for us and like I said that justifies very heavily to the community when it is coming from the young person at the coalface because they are identifying their needs and wants, how they can see their identity within the school and how we can make it a safer space.

So my stepping stone would be student agency as the first step and that will naturally, with natural momentum, bring other people along. And then that's also giving them some empowerment to actually network and talk to other teachers in the school, attend meetings, have conversations, follow through and know they'll be supported in those conversations because behind the scenes, we've also engaged in some training and development around those motives as well.

Dale Atkinson:

Yeah, that baseline of student agency. It's a theme that kind of keeps coming up again and again in this podcast. Yvonne, we know as a department that a sense of belonging for all students is really important, but that some of our students face more challenges and more head winded issues as a result of societal issues and other issues. And prioritising their mental and emotional wellbeing has got to be one of our things that we go after in order to support their academic achievements. For the LGBTQIA+ group of students, why has that been defined as a priority cohort?

Yvonne Kranixfeld:

We know that gender diverse intersex and sexually diverse children and young people are a priority or a marginalised cohort or group of people because they are more vulnerable than the general population for various reasons. So they've got limitations or they're compromised in terms of their access to opportunities or rights, they're more likely to experience harassment, discrimination within school and outside of school. This group of children and young people experience much higher rates of harassment, discrimination and violence and those negative experiences really have a compounding impact on their wellbeing.

So when that's happening outside of school in their families, in their communities and at school it really minimises the ability for those young people to learn because their internal resources are really spent on being on watch, responding to those microaggressions and responding to misgendering and those sorts of things that are happening every day, maybe sometimes before they've even gotten through the front gates.

Dale Atkinson:

So what resources are available from the Department to schools to help them support this group of students?

Yvonne Kranixfeld:

So the Department has quite a range of resources and support available to staff. Starting from the very top, we've got a minister, we've got a chief executive, we've got senior executives that are and throughout the whole Department of Education that are really highly committed to addressing that imbalance in wellbeing that LGBTQIA+ children and young people experience in schools. So to start we've got a mandatory policy and procedure that all schools, all children's centres, preschools everywhere needs to comply with.

We've got policy advice, so phone calls, emails, absolutely any reason big or small, we respond to those. We've got an expert consultant who we can bring on board for when there are those particular issues or situations that might require some more ongoing levels of support for some more complex issues. And then we've got two professional learning options that are designed to improve understanding of the basic terminology, obligations of staff and that whole school inclusive approach.

And so we've got an average of about 200 staff a month that register for the online module and that's available to all department staff. And we've had over 2000 staff complete the whole of school face-to-face training option as well. And that receives really positive feedback for how that's improved staff, understanding and confidence in responding to gender-diverse, intersex and sexually diverse students and understanding their obligations. Beyond that we've got multiple department policies, approaches, guidelines, action plans etc that specifically highlight LGBTQIA+ children and young people as a priority group like the bullying prevention, camps and excursions, policy, suicide prevention action plan, things like that.

So the Department really recognises that they are a priority cohort. The Department's Strategy for Education, areas of impact, equity and excellence, wellbeing, that again recognising that the potential of every student really lies in that individual understanding of wellbeing and what it means to be themselves at school. I'd encourage anyone to go and have a look at the EDi page, so the Gender and Sexual Diversity EDi page. We've just added some new information and resources there, so that's a great source of information to support staff.

Dale Atkinson:

And of course the links and information are available in the show notes, so please you know feel free to access those and explore as much as possible and Yvonne and her team are also available when required to provide advice, should you seek it. My throwback to you, Willow, to have the final word, I think. So the listeners of this podcast are predominantly educators from across the state. Is there a message that you'd like to give to teachers and principals and leaders about how they can improve the life of students like yourself?

Willow:

Well, the best thing I could say is, just recognise their identity because recognition is very important even for someone like myself. It is kind of a surprise when someone actually uses the correct pronouns and my brain kind of goes off like ‘whoa, that's that's really cool’. Yeah, and it's just good to be nice to other people because that in itself is kind of rewarding I know that there are a lot of people out there who just don't really understand that but among teachers, principals, general authority figures, because you know the students that you teach are like the next generation of adults in society. It's best to recognise and accept them for who they are and support them, much like how Mr. Goodwin went on about student agency.

Dale Atkinson:

Thank you very much. I think that's a really good sentiment, Willow. Again, as we said at the top of this episode if you do need support please seek assistance from one of the services listed below on our show notes. Willow, Taylor, Yvonne, thank you very very much for your time.

Yvonne Kranixfeld:

Thank you.

Willow:

Thankyou for having me.


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